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Wednesday, January 7, 2009

Potter County Commissioners Replacing Chief Clerk

CHIEF CLERK FIRED?

In response to an inquiry by "Solomon's words," about a comment, received today, that long time Potter County Chief Clerk Cora Thompson had been fired from her job, the Potter County Commissioners issued the following statement late this afternoon
:

From: Potter County Commissioners
Date: Jan. 7, 2009

STATEMENT ON CHIEF CLERK

In 2007, the voters of Potter County spoke decisively in favor of change in the direction of county government. Our Board of Commissioners took that mandate very seriously. However, we also recognized that any change made merely for change’s sake is irresponsible and shortsighted. Additionally, each of us recognized that a significant portion of our first year as a board would inevitably be a learning experience, even as we tended to the day-to-day operations of a $7 million budget and a workforce in excess of 175 people.

Initially, in recognition of the need to familiarize ourselves with county operations -- and with sincere respect and appreciation of those services rendered prior to our taking office -- we thought it best to continue the employment of those department heads and other appointees who possessed some of the experience and the knowledge that we lacked.

With the ultimate goal of improving operations and affecting meaningful change, our evaluation of county functions and personnel is ongoing as we embark on a new year. In the near future, we will receive the results of Susquehanna Group Advisors’ comprehensive evaluation of the county’s financial condition and fiscal management practices, which will include recommendations for improvements to be made over a multi-year period.

In addition to the fiscal changes that are anticipated, this Board of Commissioners hopes to develop and implement updated human resources policies to better serve county employees in areas such as compensation and benefits, professional growth and advancement within the organization. This reflects a businesslike approach to operating the county government, based on the fundamental principles that strong performers should be rewarded, while loyalty and teamwork are encouraged. It will result in a more pleasant working environment and, most importantly, a more productive and efficient workforce.

Change does not always come easily. At times, it requires an employer to make some difficult decisions. After a thorough analysis and consideration of many factors, including the growing demands on the key administrative position of Chief Clerk, our board has determined that we must make a change. As we move forward, the Chief Clerk will be required to demonstrate financial skills and abilities that assist the Board of Commissioners in keeping pace with fast-changing, complex and demanding requirements of county operations.

This decision is not a reflection on the individual who has occupied the position during our first year, but rather, another indication of the seriousness with which we are taking the voters’ mandate for change, as well as our own intentions to improve fiscal operations and better manage and develop human resources.

It is the Commissioners’ intention to fill the Chief Clerk’s vacancy as expeditiously as possible. During the interim period, questions or requests involving the Commissioners’ Office should be referred, depending on their nature, to:

Lucinda Weakland, Secretary, (814) 274-8290, Ext. 207

Kathleen Majot, Fiscal Department, (814) 274-8290, Ext. 204

Please join us in expressing best wishes to Cora Thompson and in thanking her for her many years of service to Potter County. We appreciate the public’s patience and understanding during the transition period.

75 comments :

Anonymous said...

I think the new clerk will have the initials J.S.

Anonymous said...

It looks like our one term Commissioners will pick the brains of long time employees and then replace them with their cronies. Yep, they are ONE TERM ONLY Commissioners. Wait until the people speak the next election.
I hope Northwest Bank doesn't hire one of them back. That move will lose customers of that bank for sure.

Anonymous said...

This difficult issue has been handled with discretion and sensitivity. I am one of those voters in the majority who voted for "change" and I have been waiting for it and getting pretty impatient. Let's focus on the bigger issues of cleaning up the county's finances and personnel issues and show some respect without all the speculation and false assumptions and politics.

Anonymous said...

Let's be realistic. The chief clerk likely did a fine job until the requirements exceeded her skills. In order to operate a business effectively the employees must be continually educated to a changing world. It's unlikely the commissioners were vindictive in this case, just looking at efficiency.

Anonymous said...

This board is doing a good job. Changes have been needed for some time but were not made by the past board. It's not unreasonable to think this board will make other needed changes in the future.

Anonymous said...

You all sound like Obama voters. Change, what kind of change and at whos expense.

Anonymous said...

well the chief clerk (who happens to be my mother) was doing a fine job. it was the intentions to replace her(and alot of others) from day 1 . this DREAM TEAM seems to be interested in turning things upside down. most likely our pockets as well.
Cora has been with the Court House for 21 years now, and up until now was doing fine,,,,,,,all i can say, is , HOLD ON TO YOUR A$$E$, AND BRING YOUR OWN LUBE, CUZ ITS GONNA BE ONE RUFF RIDE FOR THE NEXT 3 YEARS!!
thanx.....Eric

Anonymous said...

I would hope the previous comments by a child of the Chief Clerk, were not an example of the mother's professionalism.

Anonymous said...

Really....no wonder she got cannned. Raising kids with that kind of attitude.

Anonymous said...

The whole explanation sounds like a bunch of BS to me.

Anonymous said...

I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts.
Will Rogers

Anonymous said...

Nothing against Cora, her professionalism and personality exceeds many people I know. But I believe in this day and age the can bring in someone with a larger tool set that can benefit this county probably for less money than they currently pay the position, its happening everywhere, if you pay attention.

Anonymous said...

The commisioners past and present could have sent Ms. Thompson to take courses and training to hone her skills and educate her on more current aspects of her position. Would have been cheaper and more efficient than training someone completely new like they will have to do now Potter County, once again showing why it trails other counties in modern thinking.

Anonymous said...

Or Cora could have sent herself to take courses and training to hone her skills and educate her on more current aspects of her position.

JMHO

Anonymous said...

It isn't the county's responsibility to send an employee back to school to get a BS in Accounting or their Masters in Business so they better fit a position.

Besides if they sent anyone to a class anywhere, the haters would find out and jump all over the board with the whole "Gee it must be nice to go back to school on the taxpayer dollars" argument.

They cant win. People complain to hear themselves complain and there is no pleasing them.

Anonymous said...

Will this position be posted or just filled?

Anonymous said...

I'm wiondering if the next Chief Clerk's initials will possibly be
J.S.

Anonymous said...

TOUCHE....JMHO

Anonymous said...

People are losing jobs all over the country... Why is there an article about one person being laid off... Who cares? Lifes a bitch and then you die.

Anonymous said...

To the above blogger...

It does matter when you get "FIRED", expecially when there has be no reason determined as to why.
Yeah, the Commissioners want to make "changes", so having someone lose their job at this time in the economy...WOW, that's a great way to start.
Apparently, you don't care about anyone but yourself.

Anonymous said...

JMHO,
Why should Cora send herself to take and pay for those classes? It's the county's need for a clerk so they should make sure that the clerk has ALL training and knowldedge he/she needs and provide with continuing education should it be necessary. Her resume was good enough 20 years ago, why not now? The county could afford to help her help them. It's not her finances she is being paid to control. It is Potter County's. They should invest in her. They do every other position. Don't be so short-sighted and narrow-minded.

Anonymous said...

JMHO,
Why does Cora have to send herself to take and pay for classes for the county which she works for? She wasn't working for herself, she was working for Potter County. Therefore they are responsible for continuous improvements in the education and knowledge of their personnel and their dealings in county business. Her resume was good 20 years ago, why not now? every other position within the county requiring con-ed is funded by the county. Lots of trips to harrisburg, yes. But to the benefit of the county and at no cost to taxpayers since continuous education is reimbursed to the county by the state. Ask other county workers if they pay for their own continuous education while holding a position for Potter County. Cora deserved better.

Anonymous said...

It's interesting that the commissioners say they are listening to the "voters mandate for change," Is it good policy to replace a hard working employee with 21 years edperience with someone who has no idea about the workings of county government? I think not. This is yet another chapter in the "Book of Knowledge" of the commissioners who, as far as many of us are concerned have no knowledge of good fiscal policies themselves. It's a shame to take away a job from someone who is trying to raise three grandchildren and give it to a stranger. How sad- indeed- how sad. Especially if she is replaced by a "good friend" of one of the commissioners. I hope I'm wrong in this prediction.

Anonymous said...

I think the statement from the Commissioners was well written and VERY kind. It does not matter how long Cora has worked for the county. Those of us who had been in the court house during her "employment" know that there were issues with proffesionalism and integrity. County trips became family vacations....which is just weird. The prsent board of Commisioners have the right to appoint anyone they feel can best serve the County as Chief Clerk. As with everything those 3 have done so far, it will be well thought out.

Anonymous said...

Wake up Potter County! This so-called dream team has their own agenda which only benefits themselves. They are only interested in helping their buddies get a head and in what they personally feel is right for the rest of us. They don't listen to the voters! I heard about their plans to get rid of Cora even before they were elected, as they had a friend who wanted the position.

Anonymous said...

A fact for those who don't know: Cora Thompson DID take extra trainings to keep current with state regs, etc.

Anonymous said...

If John Snyder gets hired to fill this position I hope the commissioners don't expect to be re-elected for only an idiot would vote for them.

As for the above co-worker of Cora's I wouldn't defend this decision just yet, your job may be next.

To those who spoke of Cora's son and parenting skills, I say this, for the past twenty years I have dealt with the children of "Coudersport's finest" on a regular basis and they were and continue to be the worst kids I have ever dealt with, what does that say about the parenting skills of Coudersport's finest.

I think Cora's termination is a crock of shit. Oops I guess my parents didn't have good parenting skills either.

Anonymous said...

"Dream Team" - aren't dreams just a way to fulfill a person's fantasies?

Anonymous said...

I remember a night when a child of one of the commissioners damaged the movie screen at the local movie theatre, stellar parenting skills on display that night don't ya think.

Anonymous said...

this reaks of the state of Illinois. hope they didn't charge as much for the chief clerks job.

Anonymous said...

Who is John Snyder?
Does he live in Coudy?
What has been his past employment position?

Anonymous said...

I am not sure what Mr. Snyder's past employment was, but he is about to become the Chief Ninja in the Woodpile...

Anonymous said...

Now playing in Coudersport for the next three years, "CLUELESS IN COUDERSPORT" with it's all star cast of the three stooges.

Anonymous said...

This site needs some changes! It's no better than a tabloid and the negative blogging has now "officially" gotten out of hand.

Anonymous said...

"JMHO,
Why should Cora send herself to take and pay for those classes?"

Um, maybe so she wouldn't find herself in her current predicament?

"no cost to taxpayers since continuous education is reimbursed to the county by the state"

Free, huh? Don't you know where the state gets its money?

Just because one works for the Govt, they shouldn't expect to have everything handed to them.

JMHO

Anonymous said...

I believe it is quite apparent that this blog has become nothing more than a shooting gallery for those that use the firing of Cora Thompson as a channel to lash out at the Commissioners decisions and actions.

The people of Potter County “ELECTED” the Commissioners just as this country elects its President. Obviously the majority of Potter County residents feel that these three individuals, or as the above bloggers have stated the “Dream Team”, know what is best for the county. Could it be that the “Negative” bloggers are more concerned with attacking the Commissioners than they are actually concerned about Cora’s professionalism and job performance and WHY she was fired?

And where is the proof that this John Snyder has a “Grand Scheme” to take Cora’s former position. I believe it is irresponsible to spread rumors that may or may not have any truth attached to it. FACTS help when making an argument.

Anonymous said...

Does Jim go to one of their churches, was this posted for public the commisioners need to learn from thier mistakes and just hire someone. Example the new maintaince man the cleaning crew.

Anonymous said...

"This site needs some changes! It's no better than a tabloid and the negative blogging has now "officially" gotten out of hand."

That what anonymous blogging is all about. It's nice to speak ones mind and remain anonymous.

I found a blog that sounds perfect for you. It's called "Mr. Rogers words for the wise" There are no negative comments, the blog is patrolled and all "meanies" are removed. It's all about smiles, happy thoughts and pats on the back. "It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood..." Yawn.

Good job Jim.

JMHO

Anonymous said...

cora attended conferences. this dream team made politicl promises and guess they are keeping them. morley is a jerk, heimel is an self-serving a@# and little susie is praying at the church a lot. oh be sure changes will be made . it is pay up time for the new board. what a mess the county is in with all the lies. glad i only am home once in a while. you can bet your a#@ doug has a replacement for cora don't expect to apply or get thru the door - what little dougie wants - he gets and other 2 have less of a clue! thanks newbie voters for what? don't forget tod brown or mitch delong cause they are in this mess somewhere.

Anonymous said...

"don't forget tod brown or mitch delong cause they are in this mess somewhere"

Wonderful idea, either of those two would be great choices!
BTW-Todd is spelled with two t's and proper names are capitalized

Anonymous said...

It seems to me the three commissioners are doing a commendable job! Cora should not be allowed to say in the position just because she has been there a long time. If she can't do the job, she needs to be replaced. If John Snyder or Mitch DeLong are canidates for the position than I feel the county will be a better place because of it. They are both excellent men.
Remember, the nation elected a new president with little experience and no record of acomplishments, all under the banner of "change". I hope all you na sayers and nasty bloggers like the change you must have voted for, because you haven't seen anything yet!
The county problems are about to be amplified by what this new president is going to do. It will be no fault of the current commissioners, but I am sure a small few of you that post many times over on this blog will will continue with your nasty post, calling the three fine commissioners, "dream team", or "one term commissioners.", but at least they are moving ahead with the important business of governing our county.
Now they need to get rid of Bruce Cahilly as the county Solisitor, Wanda Shirk, as the planning Commission chairman, and Charlotte Detrick as the Planning Director. There are manny people more qualified than these three.

Anonymous said...

I just want to know how to get one of these cushy new jobs? Do I attend the commissioner's meetings or read the news and maybe check in with Career link? Do I follow all the traditioal methods of job hunting? Or are these positions all typically filled during Sunday worship services down at the BIG building?

Anonymous said...

Wanda Shirk has done a fine job, I have attended a few meetings in the past and have liked what she has had to say.

Anonymous said...

Common sense tells us that Mrs. Thompsons twenty plus years as chief clerk speaks volumes for she has forgotten more than two of our comissioners will ever have a chance to learn in their three remaining years as commissioners. Cora was trained by a man who had 60+ years of experience. Would you rather have a brain surgeon operating on you with 1 year experience or 20?

I'm sure even though Susan has more experience than the others she still hasn't had a chance to learn all the workings of the county.
When did Heimel and Morley ever have experience budgeting 7 million dollars.

Anonymous said...

One poster asked:
"I just want to know how to get one of these cushy new jobs?"

I say:
If giving one of these jobs was my responsibility, the chance of YOU getting one after reading your post would be less than none. The county needs good people. You clearly would not fit the mold. I would say you are destin for a minimum wage job or an unemployment check.

Anonymous said...

"Now they need to get rid of Bruce Cahilly as the County Solicitor, Wanda Shirk, as the Planning Commission Chairman, and Charlotte Deitrich as the Planning Director. There are many people more qualified than these three."

YES!!!!

Anonymous said...

You know JMHO, you seem to have an answer for everything. The county pays for classes and courses as needed for its employees. You certainly should know where taxes go, you and I gotta pay them. The courses that county employees on any level need to take from time to time BENEFIT THE COUNTY YOU LIVE IN AND BUILD MOTELS AND CAR WASHES IN somwhere down the line. Cora should have been afforded the same. She, nor anyone working in a county position, should have to pay out of thier own pocket for courses that benefit the county unless they are reimbursed for such training by her employer, and as long as that course benefits the employer. REGARDLESS, she got screwed out of work at a time when jobs are precious. Can you afford to hire her?

Anonymous said...

"english major said..
Wonderful idea, either of those two would be great choices!
BTW-Todd is spelled with two t's and proper names are capitalized"

ACTUALLY...Todd is spelled with two d's, not t's, as you previously suggested...and yes, proper names are capitalized...keep on majoring, major!!

Anonymous said...

"The county needs good people." Are you serious? When did that start? Just take a look around at the offices down in Roulette. Where are the "good people"? You stated that I couldn't get a job for the county because I "didn't fit the mold." You might be right about that one I resigned (not fired) from a position at the county because I just didn't fit in. I was not able to say "not only do work for .... department or agency but I'm also a client!" I had just a little too much self respect to work with some of these people. I have moved on to much bigger and better things. I hope others are able to do the same.

Anonymous said...

One poster says:
"You might be right about that one I resigned"(from the county job)
I say:
You must be the guy that is always running down the new commissioners. We still don't know your name but know we know your reasoning. You didn't fit!

Anonymous said...

JMHO,
" Mr. Rogers words for the wise"! That was good! Lol!! :) Brad

Anonymous said...

Cora may not have been the perfect person but she did her best to do the job she was given to do. You can only do a job with the information given to you. working for the county is like beating your head against a wall sometimes. The majority of county employees put forth 120%+ only to be shit on for not giving 150% for such low paying jobs. keep up the good work all county employees. most of you deserve better and should be more appreciated. Thank you Cora for your friendshp over the years.

Anonymous said...

Three years will soon be here and the actions of the three of you won't be forgotten and your destiny will once again be in our hands! A couple of you ought to take a good look in the mirror. This is a perfect example of the pot calling the kettle black. As for you Cora, I am sure the change we all want was not to see you fired. Soon the people of the county will learn this is a clear case of the buddy system. People who CAN'T run their own lives have no business trying to run others. Just remember, what goes around - comes around.

Anonymous said...

Responding to: "Those of us who had been in the court house during her "employment" know that there were issues with proffesionalism and integrity. County trips became family vacations....which is just weird. "

Don't know where this came from or who the "us" is that they are speaking for but someone obviously hasn't checked their facts and apparently hasn't been paying much attention while working in the courthouse. Otherwise, they would have known that during the previous board's term, Mrs. Thompson was blocked from attending any training or conferences. Further, they would also have known that it is a common and accepted practice in both government and private business for employees to bring a spouse or other family member along on business trips as long as they pay the extra cost. This just sounds pretty immature and like someone has a personal axe to grind.

Anyone who has been around the courthouse even half as long as Mrs. Thompson was might have noticed that there are now several people doing what she used to do by herself. That shows just how much the county operations have grown over time and is a credit to her ability to get done what needed to be done long before additional help was provided.

If this change was supposed to be about improving finances, I doubt that the pay for the next chief clerk will be lower. If it was supposed to be about getting a "better-skilled" county employee, why not add education to experience instead of throwing the baby out with the bath water? It's still just doesn't seem to make much sense. Too many unanswered questions and it seems that some find it easier to try to blame the former chief clerk rather than ask some tough questions about this decision and how it's supposed to benefit the taxpayers of the county.

I hope there can be more informed debate on this issue and less gossip level chit-chat.

Anonymous said...

The two Kid's would have fired Ferdie if he was still here.

Anonymous said...

I agree. Like I stated before, proper courses, refresher courses, new courses all should have been afforded Cora, and are certainly afforded any county employee when required or needed to make them better. Probation officers continually go to training. Human Services officials and employees attend conferences, trainings and seminars. As does the judge. From what I understand, Cora never had an evaluation so what feedback did she get as to her job performance?

Anonymous said...

I WOULD NOT ASKED LUCINDA WEAKLAND FOR THE TIME OF DAY LET ALONE ANYTHING ABOUT FISCAL MATTERS. THIS COMES FROM WITHIN!!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

If you want to be in the "loop" get involved with the Educational Council. That is where all these people. ie Mitch, John, Todd etc get their connections. As far as contiunued education, check the teachers, We pay for all their schooling even if they take "cooking classes" So just going to school does not make a person more knowledgeable. Sit back and see their (the 3 wonderpersons) next step. SUsan is just as bacd as Paul and Doug.

Anonymous said...

Susan- so many of us who voted for you are disappointed that you don't have the stamina to stand up to your fellow commissioners. come on girl- show us what we thought you had when you were voted into office- A BACKBONE AND COMPASSION FOR THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE DEVOTED SO MANY YEARS TO THE COUNTY.Speak up when you disagree with them instead of "going along". Your actions will speak volumes and your credibility will be restored.

Anonymous said...

I have a better idea. Get in touch with a few past potter county commissioner canidates who wanted to be paid while they would hire someone to do their work. Go get'm guyz.

Anonymous said...

Susan-"you don't have the stamina to stand up to your fellow commissioners".

Duh, wasn't her vote the lone nay vote to the wind turbine issue? She did certainly disagree with the men.

Anonymous said...

"Duh, wasn't her vote the lone nay vote to the wind turbine issue? She did certainly disagree with the men."

AND SHE WAS WRONG!!!!!

Anonymous said...

About Susan;

She has a backbone and I am glad she voted the way she did for the wind turbine's!

You go girl!

Paul and Doug are the ones with no "backbone"!

And as far as the remark about past commissioners...just how many jobs can Paul be paid for and do in a day? A great multi-tasker I guess!

Anonymous said...

susan wrong? they are are wrong. evaluations? i know of only 1 past commissioner who actually wanted to implement evaluations. not just for cora (who really needed it) but for all department heads. did it get done? no. why? because the other 2 commissioners didn't want it. evaluate the assessment and tax claim director. he should have been canned way before Cora! evaluate the confidental secretary (she is rude and very unprofessional). evaluate the voter registeration lady. evaluate the planning director. before morley is done he will have left over jobs for those he did not promise anything. and by the way, "he" (and I do not mean GOD) controls all - why? you got me! seems like all short men have an attitude problem - or maybe they just think they are bigger than what we all known them to be. funny.

Anonymous said...

This is true. Mr. Morley's attitude really needs adjusted. As for Cora, she certainly did attend Chief Clerk Conferences. Our 3 Commissioners should take that Leadership Course at the Education Office. Maybe MD could teach it (now that's good for a laugh). You will find Mr. Morley and company at either the Second Street Roost (with JS) or Education Council office with HN. Aside from that, just walks around with his "big" attitude and know-it-all stance. Too bad for you newcomers - the rest of us actually know the three Commissioners. What a joke!!!

Anonymous said...

paul is too busy playing editor. he didn't even stay around after cnning Cora. could be there was "breaking news". don't overestimate him. paul is for paul. you just don't get it, do you? pity.

Anonymous said...

to english major - must be you are speaking right from the Ed Council's mouth. of course you would "think" JS and TB would be perfect. what is your promised position or have you already been appointed to it? give us a break -----please?

Anonymous said...

Talk about hitting the nail on the head. You have descibed each and everyone of them perfectly. What a waste of taxpayers money as they walk through town arrogant as ever.

Anonymous said...

It's nice to see that so many of you are seeing the truth.
This arrogant ness has always been there. It is in their blood.
How they ever were able to hood wink so many is beyond me.
Some truly nice people are going to suffer for it.

Anonymous said...

"You know JMHO, you seem to have an answer for everything. The county pays for classes and courses as needed for its employees. You certainly should know where taxes go, you and I gotta pay them. The courses that county employees on any level need to take from time to time BENEFIT THE COUNTY YOU LIVE IN AND BUILD MOTELS AND CAR WASHES IN"

First off I have an OPINION on everything. Second of all, what are you talking about? I am not the one that built motels and car washes in the county.

JMHO

Anonymous said...

the cheif clerk, confid secretary and treasurer were feeding the enterprise. the biggest leak in the system. fire all! now the treasurer has hooked up with commissioner morley and is now "his" confid secretary. maybe it because he doesn't have a clue and needs all the help he can get. suppose so?

Anonymous said...

Was Cora's position under Civil Service? She can always hire an attorney and sue the commissioners for wrongful discharge. There's other weird things happening with county employees and it's only a matter of time before someone fights back. Maybe she'll be the first.

Anonymous said...

It's about time that the Dream Team started cleaning house. The appearance of the former Chief Clerk's excessively decorated desk with Mickey D's figures, Looney Tunes and other unprofessional items is a reflection of the lackadaisical approach of our past commissioners and other county officials. The dark ages are gone, and it's time that all the new commissioners ante up on their promise for change and clean house in all the county offices. As a suggestion, perhaps the commissioners might offer a course in "professional dress and conduct" for all county employees. Just a suggestion, way to go on your first move!. Clorox Cleaner is a great tool for spring cleanup -- degreases and removes dirt!!!!!

Anonymous said...

John Snyder gets my vote. He's added some class to Coudersport. He's invested in the community, his wife is well known for her artistic talent, and owns a very classy and upbeat shop. She also has invested her talent, time and energy to add class to Coudersport. Snyder is an accountant, can hobnob with government officials, has a professional and quiet demeanor and has what is takes to represent Coudersport and the Commissioners in a very high profile position. I wish the Snyders well in all their endeavors in Coudersport and hope that more business like theirs would move into the community. SInce I am retired, I get together with many of my retired friends from other areas, and they always ask and remember Olga's!

Anonymous said...

If you have never been on the inside then please never look through windows and judge. The chief clerk didn't have everyone under her thumb. Only the ones that didn't have a clue as to what she was doing. Ask and you shall receive - that is - truthful information. js has been quietly going about this endeavor of his to be chief clerk since he left adelphia. quiet, yes. cunning, even more so. not a bad little man, but again bought and paid for. dress code? you are absolutely right. toe rings, long greasy hair, crop tops, flip flops, sandles with socks, sneakers - awful, just awful. change in that area is long over due. if js gets the job what will tb do? pay up doug.